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Post by CatInASuit on Jan 27, 2009 15:11:06 GMT
First, the legendary JSexton formula, reproduced in its entirety below:
Town Roles Cop: 4 Doc: 3 Vig: 2.5 Compulsory Vig: 1.5 Roleblocker: 2 Back-Up Cop: 2.5 Back-Up Doc: 2 Watcher: 2 Tracker: 2 1 Shot Vig: 2 self-confirming townie: 2 2 man masonry: 2 points each 3 man masonry: 2.5 points each 4 man masonry: 3 points each Vanilla Townie: 1
Scum Roles Basic Mafia: 4.5 Godfather: 7 Investigator: 6 Toughguy (bonus nightkill): 7 Daykiller (bonus daykill): 7.5 Roleblocker: 6.5 Redirector: 7
Serial Killer: I actually consider the SK a vanilla Mafioso for purposes of game balance, with added points for abilities like being untargetable, investigating as innocents, etc.
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Post by CatInASuit on Jan 28, 2009 8:47:33 GMT
Ok, so working backwards. I am looking at
Mafia Setup
20 players: 4 scum, 2 PFK, 14 Town
4 scum 1 x vote switcher (D) 1 x double vote (D) 1 x ToughGuy (N) 2 x Bombs, activate at end of following Night ie. delayed kill. 1 x Roleblocker (N)
Score
Redirector 6, Double Vote 6, ToughGuy 7, Roleblocker 6 Total = 25
2 PFK 1 x Mad Bomber (Alien) (D/N) 1 x Survivor
14 Town 1 x vote switcher (D) 3 x masons 1 x Compulsary Vig. 1 x xenobiologist (N) 1 x detective (N) 1 x revealer (D) 2 x roleblocker (N) 1 x watcher 1 x tracker 2 x vanilla
Vanilla 2, Detective 4, revealer 2, masons 7, vote switcher 2, roleblocker 4. watcher 2, tracker 2, Xeno 1.5, C. Vig -1.5 Total = 25
So, aiming for 4 mislynches to give the town some time, we have
4 mislynch + 8 nightkill + 1 mad bomber + 2 extra = 14 town + 1 survivor
Looks about right to me.
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Post by CatInASuit on Jan 28, 2009 8:54:09 GMT
Only two things spring to mind on this game.
1. If the compulsary Vig gives himself up early, it removes one of the night kills straight away lengthening the game in the town's advantage.
2. There are quite a few roles on the town side and I wonder if I am overdoing it slightly in their favour, the sum of the parts etc. etc
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Post by CatInASuit on Feb 3, 2009 10:01:59 GMT
Order of resolution for Night Events
Door Roleblock Mitchell
Scum roleblock Liane
Personal Roleblock Gavin
Scum Action: Jake, Steven, Marcus
Info Roles Action: Claire, Angus, Jane, Lucy, Eliot
Third Party Action Peter
Kills, Harry, SCUM
No Action: Frederick, David, Hermione, Jervais, Wendy, M4R1E
Day Action: Spike
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Post by flyingcowofdoom on Sept 6, 2009 21:32:16 GMT
I posted some questions to various role threads.
Initial thoughts:
I think the scum vote switching/stealing roles are overpowered. Essentially, it increases the number of scum by three, since they get three extra votes. Not accounting for power roles, the only way the town can win is by voting correctly, and this removes even that ability.
Aside from that, the setup is pretty cool. I like the theme!
--FCOD
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Post by CatInASuit on Sept 9, 2009 12:07:23 GMT
Ok, the vote stealer has been switched to a redirector which should cause more confusion.
Both vote stealing powers have been toned down so as not to affect the game too much but enough to cause some consternation when they do go off.
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Post by flyingcowofdoom on Sept 9, 2009 14:01:25 GMT
Accounting for the changes you made, I have to say I think the game is pretty balanced. My only concern is the secret ballot voting. The town learns a lot of information from voting patterns. Perhaps you would consider revealing the final vote count, including who's vote ended on whom, for each Day after the Day ends. There would be some confusion when people start claiming that they didn't vote for whoever when their vote gets switched, but I don't think it's a bad thing to have the Town figure out there's at least one vote switching role in the game. I don't know, I'm conflicted.
Also, if you want a co-mod I'd be happy to help out. If you'd rather do it solo I totally understand, 'cause I wanted to host my first game solo. Have you hosted anywhere else before?
--FCOD
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Post by CatInASuit on Sept 9, 2009 14:17:00 GMT
I hosted the first game on domebo "Alphatown" so I have no problems in co-modding with you. I could do with the help in the setting up idlemafia for use.
Everyone's vote will be in the open, it's just that the vote count might not represent how people think they have voted. It should also be obvious from the rules something is up.
I am tempted to give the final Day voting list to M4R1E's player as part of their Night action, but as survivors tend to lean towards the town, this might a bit too much in their favour.
I think the other thing which will confuse people is that Night death roles are not revealed especially for a large game like this and with a lot of deaths at Night, not all the information is going to come out. I wonder if there should be more ways to get all the Night deaths out?
Perhaps, give the Compulsary Vig knowledge of who he has killed as part of his role?
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Post by flyingcowofdoom on Sept 9, 2009 14:25:34 GMT
Ok, so people vote as in normal mafia, but you just won't show who's voting for whom on the actual count. I thought you were going to allow voting via PM. It's less concerning to me now.
I don't think you should give M4R1E the list of players. Survivors normally should stay the hell out of the spotlight. I suppose it'd sway the town to keep her alive, but she'd be a sitting duck for the scum.
You might consider flipping the cards in stages over several cycles, like Pleonast does in Conspiracy. That is, when a player dies at night, you reveal only their name. The following night you divulge their role. and the following night you give up the alignment. I'm not sure how that'd fit in with the color, but it's an option. This gives the coroner less of an advantage, but it's not that great of an advantage anyway. I think it's unwise to put the only hope of flipping the cards in the hands of one player, since if the coroner gets offed quickly the town would be kinda screwed.
And yeah I'd love to co-mod. We have a new way of setting up scum threads on-board so there's no new accounts for scum to create and the threads can be moved right into the main game forum after the game ends.
--FCOD
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Post by CatInASuit on Sept 9, 2009 14:38:22 GMT
Ok,
I've updated Harry, so he gets some results as well. He may double up with our journalist.
A slow flip of detail is a good idea, however, but I think would just reveal the side and not the role they played. They can guess from the title instead.
Night 1 - Player X is killed Dawn of Day 2 - Name of Player X is revealed Dawn of Day 3 - Side of Player X is revealed
I'm sure I can work it into the colour, somehow.
Don't forget this game should be fairly vicious, so alot of info may not come out.
If we can set up scum boards on idlemafia, that would be great, otherwise I would be using my own proboard scum board elsewhere.
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Post by flyingcowofdoom on Sept 9, 2009 14:40:20 GMT
Both good!
--FCOD
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Post by CatInASuit on Sept 9, 2009 14:46:25 GMT
just updated again
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Post by CatInASuit on Oct 16, 2009 8:19:05 GMT
Ok, final tweaks.
Harry finds out the side and role of who he kills at night. Steven is redirector so he can divert all effects hitting one person onto another. Which should allow him to keep some of the investigative powers off the backs of the scum at the risk of confirming the town.
Don't forget there are three roles that can play with votes: 1 town, 1 scum and 1 thrid party.
I'm looking forward to this.
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Post by CatInASuit on Oct 16, 2009 14:59:17 GMT
One last subtle gastardly twist.
I have amended Steven's redirector power so that it does not affect the aliens powers.
This is deliberate so the scum cannot redirect the nightkill if the town is trying to set it up. Otherwise it becomes too powerful.
Of course, the only detail they will see is that Steven is great at confusing humans. Says nothing in the role about aliens. ;D
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Post by flyingcowofdoom on Oct 16, 2009 20:36:06 GMT
Looks ok to me. I think it's interesting how the redirection is target based rather than actor based. That is, the redirecter selects persons A and B and actions targeting A instead affect B rather than actions A performs target B instead of A's chosen target. I don't think I've seen a role like this before, and I'm curious to see how it's used.
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